191 Nowe źródła i wiadomości językowe i genetyczne 04

Proponuję zapoznać się z tymi źródłami… żeby utrzymać rękę na pulsie… zmian… 🙂

1.
http://eurogenes.blogspot.co.uk/2015/10/lactase-persistence-and-ancient-dna.html

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Davidski said…

Milk drinking probably wasn’t very common in North-Central Europe until after the invasion from the steppe…

http://eurogenes.blogspot.com.au/2014/12/milk-consumption-in-late.html

But as per the Mathieson review, that doesn’t necessarily mean the LP allele came from the steppe.
October 18, 2015 at 4:32 AM

Nirjhar007 said…

Somewhat Related-
http://kurdishdna.blogspot.in/2015/02/lactose-intolerance-six-mcm6-variants.html
October 18, 2015 at 4:34 AM

Davidski said…

Ah, I see, all roads lead to Kurdistan.

Except there’s a shitload of R1a-Z93 all over the Middle Bronze Age steppe, and now also the European LP allele.
October 18, 2015 at 4:51 AM

Nirjhar007 said…

also this is related in case of Pigmentation however, Between SC Asians and Europeans.
http://dienekes.blogspot.in/2014/01/slc24a5-light-skin-pigmentation-allele.html
Anyway, just waiting for the aDNA, i hope it will be before this year ends…
October 18, 2015 at 4:57 AM
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Lactase persistence and ancient DNA

Harvard’s Iain Mathieson is the lead author of a recent bioRxiv peprint on the history of natural selection in Europe. He also recently posted an online review on the origins and spread of lactase persistence (LP) in Europe. He ends the review with the following comment:

This is actually rather consistent with the Itan et al. result, and it seems plausible to me that the [European LP] allele first appeared in Central Europe, was spread around Europe by the LBK, before being introduced to the steppe later by migration from Europe.

I can imagine that this conclusion won’t be everyone’s cup of tea, but I’d say it’s a reasonable one for the time being.

Indeed, it’s interesting to note the presence of the European LP allele in the Srubnaya Culture remains from the Middle Bronze Age Caspian steppe.

We didn’t find any evidence for LP in early farming populations like the LBK, or in early Bronze age steppe populations like the Yamnaya. In as-yet unreported data, we find a few copies of the allele in the Srubnaya – a later steppe population who seem to have some European Farmer-like ancestry.

The same Srubnaya sample also shows a high ratio of Y-haplogroup R1a-Z93 (4/6), which is today one of the most common Y-haplogroups in South Asia.

Now, the LP allele in South Asia is the same one as in Europe. So what this suggests, of course, is that at some point, probably during the later stages of the Bronze Age, steppe nomads closely related to the Srubnaya people moved into South Asia, bringing with them both R1a-Z93 and the European LP allele.

I’m pretty sure we’ll be hearing more on that soon from the good people at Broad MIT/Harvard.

batman said…

Perhaps it’s time to check what the 7.500 year old R1a from Onega – at the crossroad between the Baltic and the Volga – has to do with the first farmers, carrying cattles and R1a into the lower realms of Volga.

Moreover, it’s time to check how the map of movements – describing the downstream mutations of R1a adn R1b – will look like, if their common origin and ‚bifurication-area’ should happen to be where the oldest traces of cattle-farming AND the oldest populations of milk-drinkers have been found.

Looking for the waterways through which the spread of R1a/b could reach the green-fields in the wider fields and river-valleys around Uralian, the Caucasian, the Carpathian and the Atapuerchan mountains – some 5.000 years ago – we may even find the SW Baltic as a very logical area-of-origin.

This clay-rich area of origin may even explain the common tradition of pottery – combining Pitted, Combed, Corded, Curved, Cardial and Linear decorations on beakers and sculptures. Thus we may connect it to how these various ‚stylistic dialects’ occured along the spread of the descendats of y-dna R and mt-dna H, to Norway and Carelia as well as to Baalberge, Euleu and Balaton.
The leap-frog migrations – from one suitable area to the other – seemed to have followed the old routes of the early trade if flint-tools and amber-art – introducing lactase persistance and IE language to Bactria, Balkan and Iberia, just about simultaniously.

Consequently – we’re back to the temperate area where the first indutries of flint-tools and amber-jewlery occured – after ice-time:

Kliknij, aby uzyskać dostęp bt_334.pdf

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Amber_Road
October 18, 2015 at 8:34 AM

2.
http://eurogenes.blogspot.com.au/2015/07/the-ancient-dna-case-against-anatolian.html

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I won’t go into the linguistics arguments here why the Anatolian hypothesis is implausible. But it might be worth checking out a new book on the topic by linguists Asya Pereltsvaig and Martin W. Lewis: The Indo-European Controversy: Facts and Fallacies in Historical Linguistics. I haven’t read it yet, so I welcome the opinions here of those who have. I did, however, read a lot of the online articles on which the book is based.
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You don’t need to be familiar with PCA methodology to be able to read the plot. Basically, it shows that the present-day European population structure is the result of two main events:

• the arrival of early farmers from Anatolia during the Neolithic transition, which eventually caused the extinction of people like the Western Hunter-Gatherer, who is the most obvious outlier on the plot

• the expansion of Kurgan groups such as the Yamnaya, which led to the formation of the Corded Ware horizon across much of Europe and shifted the genetic structure of almost all Europeans to the east, away from the Neolithic and Copper Age samples.

These were massive population turnovers, and, as a rule, massive population turnovers are accompanied by language change. So it’s highly unlikely that any Europeans today are speaking languages derived from those of the Western Hunter-Gatherers or early Neolithic farmers of Central Europe (ie. according to Renfrew the ancestors of Celts, Germanics and other Indo-Europeans). Moreover, consider this:

• most present-day Indo-European speaking Europeans form an elongated cluster between the Neolithic farmers and the Corded Ware sample, pointing to the steppe-derived Corded Ware Culture as the proximate agent of the Indo-European expansion in much of Europe

• the only present-day Europeans who closely resemble Neolithic farmers are some Sardinians (the small Romance cluster just above the two Neolithic samples), but Sardinians spoke Paleo-Sardinian or Nuragic languages until they adopted Indo-European speech, in the form of Latin, from the Romans (see page 118 here).

Also, this isn’t shown on the plot, but the dominant Y-chromosome haplogroup of early Neolithic farmers is G2a, which is a low frequency marker in Europe today. The two most common Y-chromosome haplogroups among present-day Europeans are R-M198 and R-M269, which are also typical of Corded Ware and Yamnaya males, respectively, and probably originally from the steppe.
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Davidski said…

Afanasievo ins’t an ANE/ENF mixture. It’s EHG/ENF, same as Yamnaya.
So Afanasievo is from Europe. Again, you can see that on the global plots.
July 30, 2015 at 9:25 PM

Kristiina said…

„So Afanasievo is from Europe.”

Maybe from Eastern Europe, but Dave, in your own map, Afanasievo specimens (RISE509, RISE5011) do not cluster with Slavs such as Ukrainians or Czechs, but, instead, RISE509 cluster with Finns, Mordovians and Kargopol Russians and RISE5011 between the above and North Ossetians.

Nevertheless, according to the admixture chart K=20 of Allentoft et al paper (http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v522/n7555/extref/nature14507-s1.pdf)
– in addition to EHG (?) – Afanasievo specimens do not have the Sardinian component (=ENF?) but instead the Kalash/ Makrani/Pathan component (25-30%) + a small amount of Native American/Siberian stuff.
July 31, 2015 at 12:09 AM

Davidski said…

Kristiina, what’s above North Ossetia? Last time I looked it was the Pontic-Caspian Steppe.
And the reason Afanasievo don’t show any of the „Sardinian component” is because they don’t have any Early European/Anatolian Farmer ancestry.

So what can we make of these facts? Probably that Afanasievo came from the Pontic-Caspian Steppe, and didn’t have any ancestry from Anatolia, which is another nail in the coffin for the Anatolia hypothesis. Wouldn’t you agree?
July 31, 2015 at 12:28 AM

Kristiina said…

Yes, I agree on that. So, we should say that basically Afanasievo are EHG + Central Asia/Teal.

It is interesting to see that the core Uralic speakers cluster with Afanasievo and Yamnaya and speak languages that have close lexical and structural parallels with IE stuff. The biggest difference is the Siberian/Native American portion that is significant in some northern groups such as Ob-Ugrics and Saami.

July 31, 2015 at 1:01 AM

Mike Thomas said…

Kristiina
Yes. Maybe this all comes back to the substrate hypothesis, with the Central asian input acting on a uralic-type language to form PIE. But whatever the case, maybe a more neutral description like „Afanesievo were northwest Eurasians” would be better ?
July 31, 2015 at 1:08 AM

Kristiina said…

or Uralic languages are based on PIE + Siberian/Native American type substrates.
July 31, 2015 at 2:27 AM

Kristiina said…

Or perhaps more accurately Uralic languages are based on Indo-Uralic + Siberian/Native American type substrates and IE languages on Indo-Uralic + Caucasus/Teal stuff.

July 31, 2015 at 2:35 AM
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PF said…

„So it’s highly unlikely that any Europeans today are speaking languages derived from those of the Western Hunter-Gatherers or early Neolithic farmers from Central Europe.”

I think you meant „the vast majority” instead of „any.” In fact this may be a good time to look at the surviving non-IE languages and see whether there are any clues to be gleaned from that info.

Besides Basque, there are the Kartvelian languages (Georgian, etc.) and some Northern Caucasian languages. I’ve for awhile been curious that these regions also show the highest concentrations of G2a anywhere, the dominant haplogroup of Neolithic Europe. The correlation is intriguing.

However, looking at G2a in more detail, one can see distinct clusters which separate the Caucuses from Sardinia/Oetzi/Europe. Perhaps, just before the advent and spread of agriculture in the area, some G2a men split off and settled in the Caucuses (e.g. G2a1), while others went on to figure out farming and colonize Europe (e.g. G2a2). To speculate further, this early Caucasian G2a might be related to the „Teal” we’re looking for, either as a drifted form of an original G2a population, or via admixture between another unique/ancient group local to the region.
July 31, 2015 at 8:18 AM
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Davidski said…

Maybe, but all Caucasians show EEF-related ancestry, presumably from Anatolia, while Yamnaya lack it, and they also lack G2a.

So „teal” may have moved onto the steppe from the North Caucasus before both of these markers spread out across the Caucasus.
August 3, 2015 at 4:39 PM
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Davidski said…

It makes no difference where the „oldest” subclades of R1a and R1b are found today if they weren’t found there 3,000 years ago.

Eastern European hunter-gatherers carried R1a and R1b, so let’s see if Central Asian hunter-gatherers did too. But I seriously doubt it. Also, 99% of the R1a in the world today is R1a-M417, which certainly expanded from Eastern Europe during the Copper Age with the Corded Ware and derived cultures. Almost all of Asian R1a is a subset of this R1a.
August 4, 2015 at 10:31 AM

Unknown said…

On what basis do you say those subclades weren’t originated in that region (Iran, Turkmenistan, Afghanistan and Northern India)?
Is there archaeogenetic evidence to prove it?

I would guess it’s also possible that R1a-M417 may have been originated somewhere between Eastern Europe and the region above mentioned.
August 4, 2015 at 3:39 PM

Davidski said…

Have a close look at the phylogenetic structure of R1a-M417. All of the main branches are found in Europe; R1a-CTS4385, R1a-Z282 and R1a-Z93. The first one is restricted to NW Europe.

On the other hand, 99% of the R1a in Asia is R1a-Z93, but the most basal subclades are found in Poland and Russia.

R1b is more complex. But we have genomes of Eastern European Hunter-Gatherers carrying R1a and R1b that don’t show any Near Eastern or South Asian admixture. They’re purely European/Siberian.

So it looks like R1 fanned out from Siberia into Europe during the Mesolithic, and then expanded from the Eastern European steppe to Western Europe and Asia during the Bronze Age. Rare subclades of R1a and R1b survived in the Near East because the steppe has been a major migration highway, but they’re not from the Near East.

The trail of R1a to India now matches linguistics and archaeology very well. Corded Ware R1a-M417 > Sintashta R1a-Z93 > Andronovo R1a-Z93 > Indo-Iranians R1a-Z93 > Indo-Aryans R1a-Z93.

The R1a-Z93 Sintashta and Andronovo genomes we have are northern European, with some Siberian admixture among the latter.
August 4, 2015 at 3:52 PM

3.
http://eurogenes.blogspot.com.au/2015/09/steppe-related-admixture-in-bronze-age.html

Steppe-related admixture in Bronze Age northern Spain

An interesting detail missing from the recent Gunther et al. paper is that ATP9 very likely harbors Eastern European Hunter-Gatherer (EHG) ancestry. If true, and I’m fairly certain that it is, then what it means is that steppe-related admixture penetrated into northern Spain at the latest during the Middle Bronze Age, because ATP9 is dated to 3,700–3,568 C14 cal yBP.
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Davidski said…

Indo-Iranians were an off shoot of Sintashta and Andronovo, who were uniformly R1a.

The fact that other haplogroups were picked up later in Asia and took part in expansions that formed modern Indo-Iranians doesn’t contradict this.

It seems like you’re focused on a big bang theory of Indo-Iranian origins from a single point and time. That’s highly unrealistic.

It was a step by step process which started with the homogeneous horse worshipping/sacrificing cultures of the Don and Trans-Ural steppe.
September 21, 2015 at 4:54 PM

4.
http://eurogenes.blogspot.co.uk/2015/10/basques-are-not-simply-fusion-of.html

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The key question now is who brought the steppe-related ancestry to Basque country. Were they Indo-Europeans or speakers of Proto-Basque? Also, did they actually come from the steppe, or somewhere nearby, like the Carpathian Basin?

The reason I mention the Carpathian Basin is because, as per the PCA, Basques more or less cluster between Copper Age Iberians and some of the Bronze Age Hungarians (marked Hungary_BA). But this is just one possibility, and I’m not sure at this stage how plausible it looks with, say, formal statistics.
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5.
http://eurogenes.blogspot.co.uk/2015/10/eight-thousand-years-of-natural.html

Nirjhar007 said…

I think its impossible that Z-94 Came from West, Its East.
October 11, 2015 at 5:21 AM

Davidski said…

Very funny. Now go and have a look where Z94 Poltavka outlier clusters.
October 11, 2015 at 5:23 AM

Davidski said…

That Scythian doesn’t look half West Asian. He looks Eastern European.

The reason he’s being pulled down is because of projection bias.
October 11, 2015 at 5:31 AM

Aram said…

Davidski

My comment was a remark on the hot discussion on Eupedia. Actually I don’t think it can be used as an argument for the overall PIE umerheit question, because it is a very late sample ( 300BC), with very different social dynamics. I just wait some more southern aDNA to have an definitive opinion. Till now the Steppe theory is quite strong.

It was just amazing to see where was that Scythian. Btw Afanasiev claims that his Alanian samples also look very European. And this Alanians ( the ancestors of modern Ossetians who fled to mountains after the Mongolian invasion ) also could be somewhere near that Scythian.
October 11, 2015 at 5:55 AM

Nirjhar007 said…

Alberto,
I have said before, IE-Uralic connections exist but they are a bit exaggerated, than they what really are. OTOH IE with Sumerian,Hurro-Urartian and Semetic etc are mostly neglected or not studied with much effort…
October 11, 2015 at 10:27 AM

Nirjhar007 said…

one thing which is remarkable is that finding Z-94 from ~2600 BC (if i’m not mistaken), once it was concluded that its a post 1500 BC mutation, now we have its presence from over a thousand year old sample, i think this makes a reasonable possibility that Z-93 mutation is of ~3000 BC or even before!

It was suggested by me that there is good chance of Afanaseivo being R1a, David also agrees with that, i wonder if they come out as Z-93!!! (there is also an equal possibility that it will be just M-417 or even R1b), then what we have to see if CWC shows any R1a-Z93 or not, things will get very interesting if Afanaseivo turns out to be Z-93.
October 12, 2015 at 6:12 AM

5.
http://www.forumbiodiversity.com/showthread.php/44860-Proto-Indo-European-Y-DNA-and-mtDNA-lineages-based-on-ancient-DNA-results?p=1211369#post1211369