495 SKRBH 51 The genomic history of Southeastern Europe (Mathieson et al. 2017 preprint), czyli północna droga R1a rządzi!!! :-)


Dla mnie ten wpis to kolejny dowód na:

a) śmierć „południowej drogi R1a”, bo brak jest R1a na Bałkanach, Anatolii, itp,

b) śmierć Anatolii jako kolebki tzw. PIE, czyli także i języka tzw. PIE,

c) coś dziwnego dzieje się rolnikami z Bałkanów, bo okazują się wcale nie być aż tak anatolijscy, tylko 2000 lat wcześniej zmieszani z hodowcami ze stepu,

d) no i zaczyna się dyskusja nad około 10,500 starym R1a na stepie (Vasilievka)  i w Karelii,

e) no i to samo dotyczy R1b znalezionego w Dereivka, ale przede wszystkim na zachód od stepu… czyli R1b jako, że mieszało się wcześniej z innymi ludami, nie tak jak R1a… to zatraciło np. wiele ze swojego… hm…  „pierwotnego?” języka…    

Folker said…
I find extremely interesting: „early farmers from southern Greece are not descended from the Neolithic population of northwestern Anatolia that was ancestral to all other European farmers”.
May 10, 2017 at 5:07 AM

Gioiello said…
„intermittent steppe ancestry” intermittent doesn’t mean „massive”, I’d say it means „a little” let that I say that, being this word of Latin origin. good-by R-L51 from the East. good-by Samara
May 10, 2017 at 5:15 AM

bellbeakerblogger said…
‚Intermittent’ sounds like pockets of foreigners. Varna elite = Lower Volga? Question is if they are like later Yamnaya?
May 10, 2017 at 5:57 AM

batman said…
According to geography and the alledged bifurication of R1, Varna ‚elite’ should rather relate to a West Side Story of Lower Vistula.
May 10, 2017 at 6:30 AM

Suevi said…
I1819 (8825-8561 calBCE (9420±50 BP, Poz-81128), Ukraine_Mesolithic, Vasil’evka) – R1a
May 10, 2017 at 7:14 AM

Romulus said…
May 10, 2017 at 7:28 AM

Roy King said…
Amazing! Much R1b1a in Balkans!
May 10, 2017 at 7:28 AM

Arza said…
@ EastPole
Ukraine Eneolithic 3500 BCE I4110 from Dereivka looks like a modern Balto-Slav (Figure 1.)
May 10, 2017 at 7:28 AM

Karl_K said…
It’s nice to have enough samples that you can actually get a sense of the variety of mixing between cultures, and the regional differences in genetics. Lots of unexpected stuff here.
May 10, 2017 at 7:49 AM

Slumbery said…
About a much debated topic: it looks like GAC had no „Steppe”, it appears as a typical farmer population, but with elevated (25%) WHG. Also Comb Ware is EHG and assimilating the previous WHG-heavy groups in the Baltic.
May 10, 2017 at 7:58 AM

Karl_K said…
@Slumbery And some Comb Ware were close to 100% EHG. Very interesting that they were so isolated for so long.
May 10, 2017 at 8:03 AM

Romulus said…
Varna man belonged to Y DNA CT, what a let down, guess his golden condom ended that Y line. Other Varna are 2x G2a and 1 R1.
May 10, 2017 at 7:59 AM

Davidski said…
@Karl_K R1a is an EHG marker, native to Eastern Europe. It did not migrate there with CHG.
May 10, 2017 at 9:21 AM

irjhar007 said…
R1a is an EHG marker, native to Eastern Europe

To be neutral you can’t connect autosome with Hgs directly . But obviously we are not worried about M417- clines , they were there all over Eurasia from Meso to Early Neo , we will have to see how the pattern of M417 + emerges. I also think Meso India will also show lots of R1a M417 – , but again it will not matter much to the IE question, to which M417 can be somewhat faithfully connected. Now it turns for the Mycenaean and Maykop , very very crucial and of course India.
May 10, 2017 at 9:30 AM

Davidski said…
@Nirjhar I also think Meso India will also show lots of R1a M417-. You’re totally nuts. Take some pills and go and lie down for a while.
May 10, 2017 at 9:35 AM


Wednesday, May 10, 2017

The genomic history of Southeastern Europe (Mathieson et al. 2017 preprint)

Over at BioRxiv at this LINK:

Abstract: Farming was first introduced to southeastern Europe in the mid-7th millennium BCE – brought by migrants from Anatolia who settled in the region before spreading throughout Europe. However, the dynamics of the interaction between the first farmers and the indigenous hunter-gatherers remain poorly understood because of the near absence of ancient DNA from the region. We report new genome-wide ancient DNA data from 204 individuals-65 Paleolithic and Mesolithic, 93 Neolithic, and 46 Copper, Bronze and Iron Age-who lived in southeastern Europe and surrounding regions between about 12,000 and 500 BCE. We document that the hunter-gatherer populations of southeastern Europe, the Baltic, and the North Pontic Steppe were distinctive from those of western Europe, with a West-East cline of ancestry. We show that the people who brought farming to Europe were not part of a single population, as early farmers from southern Greece are not descended from the Neolithic population of northwestern Anatolia that was ancestral to all other European farmers. The ancestors of the first farmers of northern and western Europe passed through southeastern Europe with limited admixture with local hunter-gatherers, but we show that some groups that remained in the region mixed extensively with local hunter-gatherers, with relatively sex-balanced admixture compared to the male-biased hunter-gatherer admixture that we show prevailed later in the North and West. After the spread of farming, southeastern Europe continued to be a nexus between East and West, with intermittent steppe ancestry, including in individuals from the Varna I cemetery and associated with the Cucuteni-Trypillian archaeological complex, up to 2,000 years before the Steppe migration that replaced much of northern Europe’s population.

Mathieson et al., The Genomic History Of Southeastern Europe, bioRxiv, Posted May 9, 2017, doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/135616

See also…

Globular Amphora people starkly different from Yamnaya people

The Bell Beaker Behemoth (Olalde et al. 2017 preprint)

Posted by Davidski at 12:04:00 AM Czytaj dalej

478 SKRBH 47 The End of Old Europe and the Rise of the Steppe

Figure 11.3. Tripolye B1-B2 migrations. After Dergachev 2002, figure 6.2.

Znalazłem ten tekst przypadkiem, kiedy szukałem grafik do poprzedniego wpisu. Wydaje mi się, że jest to część książki D.W. Anthony The Horse, the Wheel, and Language: How Bronze-Age Riders from the Eurasian Steppes Shaped the Modern World… 

Uważam, że D.W. Anthony swoim brakiem znajomości słowiańskich nazw części wozu i konia, patrz np. wpis nr 44 udowodnił, jak mondra i wszechfiedząca jest ofitzjalna nałka,.. która oczywiście także nie jest uprzedzona przeciw-słowiańskio… ;-( Do tej mondrości powrócę jeszcze i wykażę, że tacy jak D.W. Anthony są uprzedzeni przeciw-słowiańsko lub… zwyczajnie niedouczeni… 😦


The End of Old Europe and the Rise of the Steppe

By 4300–4200 BCE Old Europe was at its peak. The Varna cemetery in eastern Bulgaria had the most ostentatious funerals in the world, richer than anything of the same age in the Near East. Among the 281 graves at Varna, 61 (22%) contained more than three thousand golden objects together weighing 6 kg (13.2 lb). Two thousand of these were found in just four graves (1, 4, 36, and 43). Grave 43, an adult male, had golden beads, armrings, and rings totaling 1,516 grams (3.37 lb), including a copper axe-adze with a gold-sheathed handle.1 Golden ornaments have also been found in tell settlements in the lower Danube valley, at Gumelniţa, Vidra, and at Hotnitsa (a 310-gm cache of golden ornaments). A few men in these communities played prominent social roles as chiefs or clan leaders, symbolized by the public display of shining gold ornaments and cast copper weapons.

Thousands of settlements with broadly similar ceramics, houses, and female figurines were occupied between about 4500 and 4100 BCE in eastern Bulgaria (Varna), the upland plains of Balkan Thrace (KaranovoVI), the upper part of the Lower Danube valley in western Bulgaria and Romania (Krivodol-Sălcuta), and the broad riverine plains of the lower Danube valley (Gumelniţa) (figure 11.1). Beautifully painted ceramic vessels, some almost 1 m tall and fired at temperatures of over 800˚C, lined the walls of their two-storied houses. Conventions in ceramic design and ritual were shared over large regions. The crafts of metallurgy, ceramics, and even flint working became so refined that they must have required master craft specialists who were patronized and supported by chiefs. In spite of this, power was not obviously centralized in any one village. Perhaps, as John Chapman observed, it was a time when the restricted resources (gold, copper, Spondylus shell) were not critical, and the critical resources (land, timber, labor, marriage partners) were not seriously restricted. This could have prevented any one region or town from dominating others.2

Figure 11.1 Map of Old Europe at 4500–4000 BCE. Czytaj dalej

463 SKRBH 45 Pra-Słowianie, co żyli jeszcze przed Yamnaya culture,.. czyli Sredny Stog i Dereivka culture 01



Postanowiłem pokazać Wam, że istnieje życie po za Yamnaya… a nawet, że to życie istniało dłuuugo, dłuuugo wcześniej… niż może się komuś „dobrze poinformowanemu” przez tzw. teorię kurhanową / stepową wydawać… Wg mnie było ono już pra-słowiańskie… i pochodzące od łowców mamutów, jak Karelczyk…

Dodatkowo ponownie zwracam uwagę, na trzy typy ludzki, jakie tworzyły rzekomo tzw. pra- indo-europejską kulturę jamową / Yamna / Yamnaya… o czym pisano już w 2012 roku, jak i na to, że ludzie ze Srednego Stogu mieli związki z tzw. kulturą Cucuteni-Tripolye… np. kupowali od niej wyroby metalowe, itp… Dziwne, że jakoś nie handlowali z ludami na i za Skałkazem i nie kupowali np. brązowych siekier np. od Sumerów… hehehe

A i jeszcze jedno. Niestety Davidski wydaje mi się coraz bardziej podejrzany z tą jego manią stepową… Dlaczego on nie widzi, że Yamnaya to głownie R1b, ciemne włosy, oczy, itp… dokładnie jak to widać u tzw. Celtów a nie u Słowian?!! Cuchnie mi to padliną… lukrowaną uprzedzeniem do wyciągania wniosków innych niż jego (i nie tylko jego) ukochana i umiłowana teoria kurhanowa / stepowa… która jakoś tak coraz bardziej rozłazi się szwach…

Overview of the Kurgan hypothesis.


Niestety wikipedia nie posiada strony w języku polskim poświęconej kulturze archeologicznej zwanej Sredny Stog… no bo i po co, nieprawdaż? 😦 Czytaj dalej